I want to bring in my political panel for today. Paul Scarr is a Liberal Senator and the Shadow Minister for Multicultural Affairs. Jerome Laxale is the Labor MP for Bennelong and a member of Labor’s environmental advocacy group. Welcome to both of you. Paul. It took seriously a week to apologize to Indian Australians. Jacinta Price not backing her for the leadership actually was one of the reasons that triggered her reaction. Doesn’t it send the message that it wasn’t actually about Indian immigrants, and the comments then, because she would have sacked her earlier, wouldn’t she?
Senator Scarr
I don’t agree with that PK, and I think if you have a look at Sussan’s statement, which she released following the termination of Jacinta’s appointment, you’ll see that she actually refers both to, first, the failure for Jacinta to make an apology notwithstanding she’d had the time and space to consider that issue, and secondly, it referred to the matter You raised in terms of Jacinta refusing to express confidence in the leader, and as we know, under Westminster principles, that’s simply unacceptable and untenable.
Patricia Karvelas
And do you think the sacking is enough to rebuild bridges with migrant communities?
Senator Scarr
I think these relationships always need a lot of work. I think it was really good. We were down in Sydney on Sunday, visited Little India, met with the community. We had round table discussions on Monday with community members. We heard their distress, we heard their pain. And I should say that the week before Jacinta made these comments, there was a vial pamphlet which was released before the marches, which specifically targeted the Indian community, and I received many, many calls from very close Indian friends and community leaders who were deeply concerned about that. So there are more levels to this than than simply the comments Jacinta made. [CUT OFF]
Patricia Karvelas
To be clear when she first made the comments. Paul Scarr, and I’ll get to you in a moment. Jerome, don’t get lonely. But the comments I asked her about was actually in relation to that. That there was an anti Indian sentiment to the rallies, that was very much key to the entire conversation with her.
Senator Scarr
And I accept that PK and it was causing a lot of distress in the Indian community in Australia, the Indian Australian community. I gave a speech at the first opportunity in the Senate on the Monday night before the marches after I became aware of that pamphlet to provide solidarity for the community.
Patricia Karvelas
Jerome, I am going to bring you in here. Is this done and dusted as an issue? I mean, obviously it’s been probably a good week for Labor to watch the Opposition have problems, not yourselves. But is it now, you know, line in the sand.
Jerome Laxale
Oh, look, I wouldn’t say it’s been a good week, PK. I feel for the Indian community and all migrant communities who are offended and take offense to what’s happened over the past week. I mean, the fact that Jacinta Nampijinpa Price still hasn’t apologized, and in fact, you know, blank refuses to, should be of real concern to the Indian community. And I guess I said this previously, like it just signals, it’s a pattern of behavior from members of the Liberal Party. I don’t include Paul in that, but there are others. We had Peter Dutton saying, you know, African gangs were running the streets in Victoria, couldn’t go out to dinner. He said, Lebanese refugees that, you know, Fraser made a mistake bringing them in. You had Jane Hume with the Chinese spies, comment like, this is a pattern of behavior within the Liberal Party, and it just shows to me and to the electorate that they’re just totally out of touch with modern Australia.
Patricia Karvelas
Okay, so, Paul, I’ve got to give you a response to that, because that is the charge that will be used against the Coalition, right, particularly as you enter the next political cycle.
Senator Scarr
Well, PK, it was just used by Jerome then. So I don’t accept that three or four examples of people not saying the right thing, not expressing themselves the right way, being clumsy, represents a pattern of behavior. I simply don’t accept that. What I look to is the membership of our party, which includes people from a diverse range of backgrounds, candidates running for our party, including here in Queensland, of diverse backgrounds. And the basic values, the basic values of the Liberal Party, which is no discrimination on the basis of race, ethnicity, religion, where you come from, that’s what I look at, the core values.
Patricia Karvelas
Well, let me ask you, then, because I’ve been rather exercised about Tony Abbott’s statement about an ever more diverse intake of immigrants coming into Australia, does that worry that sort of language, Paul Scarr?
Senator Scarr
I believe that every single person who comes to this country or seeks to come to this country should be considered on the basis of their individual merits in terms of what they bring to this country, their skills, in terms of their need, from the perspective of humanitarian intake. And that is a firm belief I have, and will always have.
Patricia Karvelas
The way that this whole debate, though, has gone obviously, Jerome, there are elements of the community that are concerned about what they considered to be too high levels of immigration. Do you accept that that’s a legitimate view in the community?
Jerome Laxale
Well, immigration levels are the same as what they were last year, and are 36% down on last year’s figures. They’re about the same level they were pre pandemic. Obviously, post pandemic, there was a short term spike. But I really take offense to the term mass migration. It’s a really loaded term. It’s just not based in fact. And even you have Sussan Ley going out there saying migration is linked to traffic and not being able to see a doctor and, you know, providing the services. I mean, no. Traffic issues are an infrastructure problem. Housing issues are a housing problem. Migration has made our country what it is today, the envy of the world, a multi cultural mecca, and we should not always go to the bottom drawer. Or, the Liberal Party shouldn’t go to the bottom drawer and blame migration for every policy failure of their government. Let’s not forget, they were in government for nine long years. They froze the Medicare rebate, which put pressure on our hospitals and doctors. They cut funding from education, which we’ve had to top up. So all these issues about infrastructure and having the services. I mean, they’re an issue that government need to fix, not blame migrants for.
Patricia Karvelas
Let me ask quickly then to you, Paul Scarr, this term mass migration, would you use that term?
Senator Scarr
No.
Patricia Karvelas
Why not?
Senator Scarr
Well, I don’t think it’s correct. I think mass migration, when we consider that term. You’re talking about huge movements of people from one geographical location to another. So mass migration, from my perspective, would include what happened in India and Pakistan in the 1940s when there was that huge movement of people. You might be talking about the huge movement of migrants from Europe to the new world, to the United States. That from my perspective, is an example of mass migration. So I would not use that term.
Patricia Karvelas
Fair enough. OK. I just want to move, Jerome to something that might be a bit difficult for your side of politics. The Albanese Government is about to settle on a 2035 Climate Target. That number though, will only be announced after the Prime Minister has left the Pacific Islands Forum, but he says being serious on Climate Change is the entry fee for credibility into the Pacific. So does that mean that that target has to be ambitious?
Jerome Laxale
I think the Minister has made it very clear that it needs to be both ambitious and achievable. And the reason why a target hasn’t been set yet is because, under law, the climate change authority, which is an independent organization, needs to provide that advice to government. And you know, as of right now, me sitting here in this studio at 10 past four or whatever time it is, my understanding is the government has yet to receive that advice. But it’d be no surprise to you and those who know what I do in this space, I’m pushing the government as hard as I can to make sure that it is not only ambitious, but also achievable. Very easy to do just one. Just be ambitious or be achievable. I think there’s an expectation on us to do both. It starts with that independent advice from the climate change authority, an organization that we set up, that we’ve given its license to do its job, and you know, let’s bring it on. Let’s set this target. Let’s reach it. Let’s beat it. Why not?
Patricia Karvelas
OK, let me put to you. Paul Scarr, you’ve just had this pretty ugly incident over Immigration. Is the next frontier, the net zero war?
Senator Scarr
Well, we have a process in terms of considering our policy relating to emissions reduction, the costs of electricity in this country, like reliability of the system. I’ll just take issue with one point Jerome raised there. He talked about, it’s either or, you can’t have one or the other – of ambitious and achievable. I I think it’s really hard to get the achievable with all due respect. What is achievable? And I think it’s got to be an evidence based discussion around costs and what truly is achievable. And I think that’s one of the reasons we’ll be looking very closely. [CUT OFF]
Patricia Karvelas
I just want to get you on the record, do you think your party should be withdrawing from net zero?
Senator Scarr
I will be participating in the policy discussions. I want to see responsible emissions reduction, and I want to see realistic targets and achievable [CUT OFF] I really want to see I really want to give an opportunity for that policy process…
Patricia Karvelas
So you’re not…
Senator Scarr
To take its course, because I think it’s important that’s based on the best and latest data
Patricia Karvelas
So just to be clear, you don’t have a view about whether the Liberal Party should be in the net zero commitment?
Senator Scarr
I want to see the results of the policy review process we’re undertaking. PK, genuinely I really want to see what is achievable and what the cost is. We took to the last election a nuclear power policy. I personally believe that it’s an issue which needs to be looked at further in the in the future. I think there’s a problem in terms of us being the only OECD country that doesn’t have nuclear power, but I want to see the latest evidence which has been compiled, and I want to hear from my colleagues.
Patricia Karvelas
OK, we’re out of time. Thanks to both of you.
Senator Scarr
Thank you.
