Paul Scarr, the Shadow Minister for Immigration. Paul Scarr, welcome back to Breakfast. Good to have you in the studio.
Senator Scarr
Good to be with you, Sally. I’d probably prefer it were under different circumstances, but here we are.
Sally Sara
We had you sitting next to your colleague as well. We’ve had a bit of a changeover in the studio. Are you maintaining your support for Sussan Ley this morning?
Senator Scarr
Absolutely. I supported Sussan nine months ago—and it was only nine months ago. We still haven’t had the review of the last federal election campaign released, and I think Sussan deserves a fair go. She’s had to deal with some very, very difficult circumstances, including the relationship with the National Party, and with respect to finalising our position on energy policy. In that respect, she made sure every single person’s voice was heard, and we settled on a policy position that the party has largely united behind. And then of course we had the horrific Bondi terrorist attack, and I saw firsthand how Sussan was standing shoulder to shoulder with our Jewish Australian community, but also with families—and that really inspired me. That showed true leadership. Sussan has earned my loyalty. She has my loyalty, and she’ll continue to have it.
Sally Sara
Do you think that Ted O’Brien should maintain his position as Deputy Leader?
Senator Scarr
I think Ted has done everything expected of him, and in fact I think he’s done a very good job as Shadow Treasurer. I don’t think it’s been easy, because there’s been so much background noise and so much distraction. Ted is an outstanding individual. I’ve known him a long time, and he will certainly have my support.
Sally Sara
Some of Sussan Ley’s supporters at the last ballot, like James McGrath and Dean Smith, have resigned from the Shadow Front Bench. Have Sussan Ley’s backers lost confidence in her?
Senator Scarr
I’ll leave it to colleagues to explain their actions and their reasons. That’s a matter for them. James is a fellow Queenslander—I’ve known James for 39 years. James has always acted in what he considers to be the best interests of the party.
Sally Sara
Are you disappointed in those who are changing horses?
Senator Scarr
Sally, it’s up to them. Each of us has to make our own determination as to whether we should support the incumbent or support a challenger. In my view, Sussan deserves our support, so I’ll be supporting Sussan.
Sally Sara
You’re the Immigration Spokesperson. You were formulating a policy for Sussan Ley to announce. That didn’t happen. Would the Liberal Party have been in a better position if that policy had been announced?
Senator Scarr
There were some fundamental principles that we had discussed. The current rate of net overseas migration for the year ending 30 June 2025 was 306,000. That’s still 90,000 above the 10‑year average before the COVID‑19 pandemic. I think we’ve made it clear that the current rate of immigration is too high. There are also issues with the number of people on temporary visas who are staying in the country beyond their visa period. We’ve made those points. I’ve spoken consistently about the fact that the government has abandoned medium‑term and long‑term planning. If I could see anything achieved during my time in public life, it would be the introduction of proper medium‑ and long‑term planning for migration policy, so that we never again have to have this awful debate we’re having at the moment.
Sally Sara
You’re listening to Radio National Breakfast. My guest is the Shadow Minister for Immigration, Paul Scarr. You’ve pointed to the Liberal Party review into the federal election. It hasn’t yet been released. Is it important that that review is released publicly soon, so that the party can be informed when it makes decisions about the direction it takes for the future?
Senator Scarr
How do you make informed decisions about the future unless you have the ability to debrief with respect to the previous election? I think that piece of work is very important. I undertook the review of the 2022 Queensland state election, and that was an important piece of work. The 51 recommendations from that review were implemented by the LNP in Queensland, and we’re now in government. So that piece of work is incredibly important. I would personally like to see that review released as soon as possible, and certainly I think the recommendations should, to the extent possible, be made public.
Sally Sara
Do you feel flat today about the position the party’s in and what’s about to happen this morning?
Senator Scarr
Politics is a very, very difficult occupation. I feel for Sussan, Sally. I really feel for Sussan. She’s given her heart and soul to this job. I was immensely proud of Sussan in the aftermath of the Bondi terrorist attack—standing with those families, going to funerals, standing with the community, listening to them, empathising with them, showing that leadership. It’s a difficult day for colleagues, but I particularly have Sussan in my thoughts, and that’s one of the reasons I’ve been so strongly coming out in support of her.
Sally Sara
If Sussan Ley loses the leadership today, does she also carry some responsibility for that defeat?
Senator Scarr
All of us carry responsibility—every single one of us. That includes Sussan as Leader. It includes every member of the Shadow Cabinet, including those who’ve resigned. It includes every member of the shadow outer ministry, such as myself, and everyone who has resigned from those positions. Everyone in the party room. We have a collective responsibility.
